Can anyone become a good improvisor?

JediImprov · Post by **JediImprov** » October 6th, 2011, 2:05 pm

When I first dove into this wild ride a little over a year ago, "being good" was very much on my mind and so I wasnt. Improv in general, for me anyways, has been this endless lesson on how so many things (on and off the stage), are counterintuitive. I like the first response you got, about stick around for 2-3 years. I also loved all of his comments on the obstacles that will be faced.

There were times I felt very downtrodden and like a black sheep in the crowd and others, where I felt amazing and like these are some of the most cherished experiences of my life. Either way, either moment, its my shit- and improv has taught me a great deal about that too. I gotta keep showing up, putting myself out there, and the magic just starts to happen- more and more often, the longer Im in it.

And for me, its so much about having more and more of those magical moments, those connections, then it is about some external judgement I might place on myself, occasionally still do, about good or bad.

One final thought. If you are attracted to improv and in spite of your fears and doubts, still feel compelled- like you cant let it go, then just keep coming out and having fun. At about a year, go back and take a workshop that would be more Level 1 or 2 type stuff, you will get a great reality check of how far you have come.

I dont know if I ever will get good, but Im meeting some amazing people, enjoying some amazing moments, and thats rather awesome in and of itself.

Caeriel · Post by **Caeriel** » October 18th, 2011, 1:32 am

I can only speak from own experience with my classmates at the Hideout. Maybe I just got lucky and scored an amazing class, but I honestly believe that everyone in the class has what it takes to be a very good improvisor. Sure, some people came in with a bit more natural talent, a sort of je ne sais quoi that made them naturally amusing to watch, but I've honestly been amused and entertained by each and every one of my classmates, so I really do think, perhaps hopefully/idealistically, that anyone can get to a place where they're consistently a pleasure to watch and/or play with on stage.

Ellen · Post by **Ellen** » October 18th, 2011, 1:53 pm

I believe that anyone can become a better improvisor. If you have the right attitude and enjoy what you are doing, it will show in the work. I do think, however, that someone can take classes, understand concepts, have fun, and never be great. Which is fine. As long as it is fun for him, he should be doing it.

jillybee72 · Post by **jillybee72** » October 19th, 2011, 2:06 am

I l-o-v-e what everyone is saying about their own experiences and what they can extrapolate from them. Thank you for your thoughts one and all.

fritopi · Post by **fritopi** » October 28th, 2011, 2:41 pm

DollarBill wrote:I really think we need to define "good" in order for this conversation to be worth while

This is super important. By "good," do y'all mean making the audience laugh? Establish location, relationship, conflict, etc? Supporting your partner? Following the "rules?" Are we talking short-form or long-form here?

There are so many aspects that come into play when doing improv. Very few people are "good" at all of them. It's the same with nearly every art. Hell, even in sports. Carmelo Anthony is considered to be "good" at basketball, but he's a pretty lousy defender. Chuck Hayes only averages 8 points a game, but he has other skills that make him valuable to the Rockets.

Some improvisors are excellent at creating environments. Others excel at creating characters. Some are good at taking control of scenes, others are good at supporting. Some people are just quick and witty. There are so many different abilities that are used in creating a scene. I feel that there are different exercises and techniques that can be used to help you become "good" at each and every one of those aspects.

And even then, what if you place a "good" improvisor in a show with several "bad" improvisors? That one "good" guy can't be in every scene. He can't save the whole show. It's logical to assume that show will be bad, right?

It's interesting because with improv, the end result is the piece/performance/show/whatever. Which is a result of the whole ensemble, not any one improvisor. Reggie Miller was a badass baller, but he never won an NBA championship because his supporting cast was severely lacking.

And even if you have a whole cast of "good" improvisors, what if they're all "good" in the same way? A team full of Kobe's probably won't fare well in the play-offs (I know I keep forcing the basketball analogy, but I think it works).

There's some Malcolm Gladwell book (I think it's "Outliers" or "Blink") that says you need to practice for 100,000 hours before you can be considered an expert at something. There's a ton of specific examples in the book ranging from athletes to artists to musicians. That innate talent or "certain something" that a "good" improvisor has (stage presence? charisma?) can only take him so far.

I believe that one of the most important things you need to have in order to be a "good" improvisor is the ability to react honestly (and quickly). And that is something that, at least according to Sanford Meisner, can definitely be worked on through practice.

So, yes, I think anyone can become a "good" improvisor, provided they put in the time and effort.

DollarBill · Post by **DollarBill** » November 4th, 2011, 3:59 pm

fritopi wrote: There's some Malcolm Gladwell book (I think it's "Outliers" or "Blink") that says you need to practice for 100,000 hours before you can be considered an expert at something.

It's "Outliers" and it's 10,000 hours. Which equates to 40 hours a week for about 5 years. If there's anything I'm even remotely close to 10,000 hours on it's improv. Also, it's 10,000 hours of pointed practice with the intent of improving. I type all the time but all that time spent typing doesn't count towards the 10,000 hours unless I'm practicing or reading about or thinking about typing with the express intent of typing faster.

But also, that is just his hypothesis and while he backs it up with some studies that seem to correlate, none of it actually shows 100% scientific proof of his theories.

jillybee72 · Post by **jillybee72** » November 6th, 2011, 1:31 am

Oh, let's have the fucking Ira Glass quote, shall we?

jillybee72 · Post by **jillybee72** » November 6th, 2011, 1:33 am

Also Stravinsky said it takes 20 years to become a master. I assume he meant of anything. I can't wait! I imagine on December 15, 2013 I shall awake from bed by flying into the sky and having the best improv scene with all the falcons that I meet.

mpbrockman · Post by **mpbrockman** » November 6th, 2011, 11:00 am

Somebody have Glass and Stravinsky explain Justin Bieber and/or Demi Lovato...

Never mind, I get it, they're creations. Nevertheless, it's a little disheartening to realize that by the time you're getting to that point where you're no longer disappointed with your own work (particularly as an actor or musician) you're out of the marketable demographic. Rarely does actual talent plus skill emerge from the grist mill.

Hmm... does that comment reflect more poorly upon the entertainment industry or popular taste (or lack thereof)?

Sure, and we shouldn't care about commercial success being artistes and all - but ya gotta eat - and you don't get the "Outliers" 10,000 hours being a weekend warrior.

As far as being a "master" of anything; whether it takes 10,000 hours, 20 years or some other random figure - I think the first sign of mastery is when you begin to think in the "language" of your form of expression. Then, and only then can you begin to get out what's in your head without some poor method of translation being employed. Sorry, the language analogy is the best I can come up with right now.

How do you get to Carnegie Hall...

Rev. Jordan T. Maxwell · November 6th, 2011, 7:44 pm

fuck that...i'm all about commercial success and pop appeal in my art. except for the times when i'm all about pissing off the audience and not giving a damn what people think.

i'm, like, complicated and stuff...

EmilyBee · Post by **EmilyBee** » November 8th, 2011, 10:25 am

Thanks for that Ira Glass quote!

I sent it on to Roy-my-Roy, who is in the beginning stages of this. I've been through it, gotten to the good enough, still found the business was crap (for me) and have decided to forego the music career. I am curious about what may happen when he decides to pursue photography for a money-making job. I would love for him to get to the special thing. And I'm good with making the adjustments necessary to let him pursue that, if he wants. I did it for myself, and if I can get him to a point of artistic satisfaction, something he never really thought about having before, I would be thrilled.

Yeah, so I'm not sure whether I'm an artist, but I'm pretty sure Roy is.

jillybee72 · Post by **jillybee72** » November 8th, 2011, 11:10 am

mpbrockman wrote:How do you get to Carnegie Hall...

This weekend I got a little turned around in New York but I absolutely refused to ask anyone "How do you get to Broadway" and just wandered around lost.

mpbrockman · Post by **mpbrockman** » November 8th, 2011, 11:19 am

jillybee72 wrote:
mpbrockman wrote:How do you get to Carnegie Hall...
This weekend I got a little turned around in New York but I absolutely refused to ask anyone "How do you get to Broadway" and just wandered around lost.

That's how I usually find the most interesting stuff anywhere

Jolene · Post by **Jolene** » November 8th, 2011, 11:41 am

Check in with me in a few years. If I am great, then the answr is yes, because I suck at it now, and am actually terrified of it!

DollarBill · Post by **DollarBill** » November 8th, 2011, 1:30 pm

mpbrockman wrote:Somebody have Glass and Stravinsky explain Justin Bieber and/or Demi Lovato...

Yo, Beiber despite being young, might actually have had 10,000 hours when he blew up. A lot of pro tennis players were better then 90% of the world's population by the time they are 10 years old.

mpbrockman wrote: I think the first sign of mastery is when you begin to think in the "language" of your form of expression.

And I totally get this. When I took classes at iO, I felt like I wasn't learning much NEW stuff, just like I was mostly getting better at the stuff I already knew. BUT when I was about in 6 months in I realized that what I learned was a vocabulary or a language that helped me talk about what I knew. Just getting that set really brought things into focus for me. I feel like I went from hazy ideas to a solid base. I remember going back to Austin after about a year of iO and jumping in a Micetro and feeling like Neo when he's able to see "the Matrix" while he's in it. I just knew exactly what to do. Now I feel lost again though. Oh well.